Lincoln LS V8 Missing.......

[myndkrime]

Okay....Just for anyone that possibly has any answers...

My car misses under a load...Bog down when really getting on it, then misses like crazy...Have to feather the gas pedal to get it to run...

I have replaced the fuel filter, 6 out of 8 CoP, all spark plugs, flushed the fuel system, clean the throttle body....Guess what...Still misses...

I have taken it to the dealership(first time for everything) and even they don't know what is wrong with it.....They are talking about replacing the plugs with MotorCraft plugs...This has just been more fun than I have had in a long time...

[Four Eyed Stangs]

If it were a Mustang, I'd check the fuel pump relay to make sure the high speed pump voltage is getting through.

Check your fuel pressure.
If it is a vacuum sensitive regulator, take the vacuum line off to make sure the diaphram isn't ruptured.

Just tossing out some odball ideas others may not have tried.

[Four Eyed Stangs]

Crank trigger?

Check codes?

Balance test with code reader?

Plugged catalysts?

[myndkrime]

I talked to the dealership and they said that the car seems to be missing on 4 of the 8 cylinders....When will the fun end?

Thank for the info Four Eyed Stangs, nothing is oddball when the dealership does not even know what it is and they work on these every day.

Waiting to hear from them again to see what the latest status is.

[myndkrime]

And better.......Now they have passed my car on to another mechanic at the dealership who is supposedly more experienced with these Lincolns....

[myndkrime]

And it gets better..........Just received a call from the dealership...They have given me an estimate on what they 'think' will fix the problem....

Complete tune-up - CoPs, Plugs, filter
Injection Flush
Valve Cover gaskets

For a total over $1300 plus the diagnostic time which is around $125...


I am really close to just taking this car to a dealership and trading it in for a GMC truck.

Never had this much of a problem from one car, especially with the miles that are on it...54K..

Looks like I am going to be working on this car @ the house for awhile until I can get this thing running like it is supposed to.

[gadget73]

Clean your MAF and maybe check the TPS? Not familier with the LS at all, but it sounds like its not adjusting properly to a change in either throttle position or airflow. Could also poss be a bad MAF, but that should show on a code scan as an out of range condition I'd think.

[myndkrime]

I have already cleaned the MAF sensor, even though it did not give any codes for it. Thought might as well I have done about everything else.

I have talked with a friend of mine and he was saying it is possible that the plenum has clogged vacuum ports on it. He has had that happen on 4.6L before. He had to pull of the plenum and clean out these vacuum ports and it resolved the problem.

I am going to replace all the spark plugs and the v/c gaskets, grommets, spark plug O-rings and see what happens from there.

Oh as far as the dealership, I will NEVER take anything to them again. I got my car home yesterday and looked over my car. Bolt missing from the spark plug cover on bank 1, pop clip missing from the "Lincoln V8" cover and the air channel to the throttle body was loose....Not to mention lovely handprints all over the front of the car...

[pro-five-oh]

I know the 4.6L engines are finicky when it comes to spark plugs. I would recommend putting in the factory spec plugs and see what happens.

You also need a code scanner to check for codes, you know the dealer isn't trustworthy for that kind of diagonsis.

[myndkrime]

Just finished fixing the valve cover gaskets and replacing the spark plugs with factory plugs. Still doing the same thing....I am at a loss, I have no idea why the car is acting like this....I guess I move on to taking off the plenum and checking it out and making sure that everything is correct.....ANY IDEAS FROM ANYONE IS VERY WELCOME...............

[Steve L]

I don't know much about the LS models but I do know the 4.6 engine. You must determine whether the problem lies with spark control or fuel control.
Are there codes as pending (no MIL lamp) or as a set DTC (MIL lamp lit). Run the codes with a scantool.If you have coil packs and spark to the plugs is the problem area. I would have these checked.These are prone to internal arcing. Usually you will get P0300 thru P0308 codes.
If the problem lies with fuel delivery, run a fuel pressure test.If too low the engine will miss or stall or not even start. Replace the fuel filter if restricted. Apply vaccum to the pressure regulator with engine off. diaphram should hold vaccum steady at 15 in/hg. Replace the fuel pump if pressure is too low. All I can think of for now. Looks like you have checked alot of other things. :D

[eL eS]

did you replace any of the coils?

[myndkrime]

I am back again....The friend of mine and I removed the intake and check the 'ports'. Okay for anyone interested in knowing for the future the 3.9L V8 is a one piece intake not 2 like the 4.6L. If you remove this you more than likely will have to have replacement gaskets(8), one for each cylinder. Just in case you may also need to get a replacement gasket for the butterfly intake, because you will need to remove this to be able to access one of the intake bolts underneath.

Well we removed the intake, replaced the gaskets and cleaned out all the carbon from the intake manifold and the EGR valve ( lots of carbon on the EGR). Put it all back together and yes, it is still having the same problem.

For the record here is the list so far:

Air Filter
6 of 8 CoPs
Spark Plugs (x2)
Replaced V/C gaskets - Both sides
Fuel Filter
Removed Intake, cleaned carbon, reinstalled....

I think I finally know what is going to fix this car.......Gallon of gas and a match!

[myndkrime]

Codes...We don't need no stinkin' codes...

Sorry just have a case of temporary insanity.. Codes was multiple misfires in bank 2 in which I have already replaced all the CoPs in bank 2 and replaced all the plugs...Still no love from the lincoln.

[megaforcer]

quote:Originally posted by myndkrime:
I think I finally know what is going to fix this car.......Gallon of gas and a match!

Do it, Do it :D then tape it and send the footage to Lincoln headquarters with the massage: "you are next" :D

[clouderold]

quote:Originally posted by megaforcer:


Do it, Do it :D then tape it and send the footage to Lincoln headquarters with the massage: "you are next" :D

LOL! :D

[myndkrime]

And the Saga continues....

As we join our hero in the never ending search of what is wrong with the Lincoln LS.

With the assistance from members of the family, our hero was possibly going to take the LS to another 'reputable' stealership.

But when our hero got in the car to take it to work this morning, the LS would not start.

Time after time our hero tried to start the LS in order to complete his mission at work but was unable to restore the LS to an operational state...Will the LS start? Will they ever be able to find out what is causing the problems? Will they find out about Joan and her illegitimate child? ....Join us again for the continuing saga of "As the Axle Turns"...


Short of it......Tried to get it started this morning and it would not fire....Turns over no problem but would not start..Going to borrow a friends fuel pressure gauge to see if that is the culprit.....

Will let everyone know what is happening..

[myndkrime]

Okay, now this car is just getting to be an enigma of mammoth proportions....Went to borrow my friends fuel pressure gauge but he was unable to find his. So, stopped by Sears on the way home and picked one up. After doing the regular routine after getting home, I hooked up the fuel pressure gauge to the fuel rail and turned on the ignition, Key ON - Motor Off, to see if I was receiving presssure..I was receiving some pressure so I went ahead and tried to start the car. It cranked right up? So I gave it some gas to see if the pressure would increase and it did increase. 10PSI @ idle and 18PSI @ throttle...So I was puzzled when I was finished so I started trying to find the specs on the fuel pressure for the 3.9L but was unable to find anything....Will look some more......So this morning I thought I would drive the car to see how it did, and ????

You guessed it, it would not start again....Just turned over but would not fire..

Gallon of gas and a match are looking very promising.....

[HOTLINC]

I really think you have a bad one or two COP's.

Do you live in a humid or high moisture climate?

I have shorted out 3 or so of those things every spring when I would clean the V6 in my LS. I would take it for a spin and that's when the trouble would start. It doesn't take much to drown one of those things. So probably any moisture could kill one.

If one is misfiring, you would think that V6 was running on 3 cylinders. It is horrible. The engine shakes hard and the only way to get it to run semi-smooth is to "feather the throttle" like you said.

It seems to me that the original COP's were replaced with a different version around 2001 or so.

In my opinion, you still have bad COP's. You need to find the bad ones and replace them. I don't think it matters if they are "new", they could still be bad.

You need to get an OBDII scanner. It should tell you which cylinder is misfiring - or is the V8 different. My V6 told me exactly which cylinder COP was misfiring. At least my OBDII tool does.

[myndkrime]

And the latest...

Okay, found out from the parts guy at the dealership that the fuel pressure is supposed to be running between 35-65psi, so mine is running way too low. I will check out the wiring and power to the fuel pump. If everything is okay then I guess that I will move on to replacing the fuel pump....Just a question if anyone might have an answer....In the fuel tank there is a fuel pump and a jet pump...What is the main purpose for the jet pump??

[jonota]

Ok, sorry long time no post/read here guys, been underway for a while...

NE ways, now that I've read everything myndkrime, I stand a little more informed. I still stand by what I said in the emails, but the fuel pressure you were quoted seems a little odd. A 30psi spread in operating pressure seems off to mee, should be more along the lines of 8-10psi spread... but 10 is DEFINITELY way low, too low to possibly even start. The times it didn't start vs the times it did: which days were warmer and colder??? As I said, look for fuel system blockages and a possible bad fuel pump.

Jonota

[myndkrime]

Hello from hell......

Weather is here, wish you were beautiful...
Let's go through the list -

Fuel Filter
Air Filter
Cleaned MAF
Replaced 6 of 8 CoPs
Replaced Spark Plugs x 2
Replaced Valve Cover Gaskets - Both Sides
Removed and cleaned intake manifold
Fuel Pump

No better then it was before, same issue. So the car is going to be sent off to some former dealer mechanics who specialize in Ford, Lincoln and Mercury vehicles...

Just for everyone elses knowledge I will let you in on the reason for a jet pump and a fuel pump on the LS...

Fuel tank goes from one side of the car to the other side of the car...In doing this it has to be contoured to that the driveshaft and exhaust will also fit..So the gas tank is in the shape of a saddle bag, two larger portions and then a thin portion in between..
The jet pump assists in supplying more fuel pressure to move the fuel over to the fuel pump side of the tank....Also so you know jet pump left side and fuel pump right side....

You will be able to access the fuel pump and/or the jet pump by removing the rear passenger seat, pulling back the sound dampening insulation and then removing a large circular plastic cover, one for each....The jet pump will have 3 fuel lines, 2 red connections and 1 white, and a 2 - wire electrical connection. The fuel pump will have 2 fuel lines, 1 red 1 white, and a 4 wire connection since you also have the fuel gauge float apart of the fuel pump assembly....
Disconnect the wiring harness.
You will have to push the tabs on each side of the clips and hold them in to pull out the fuel lines.
Unscrew the large blue ring and then place the top to the side....The fuel pump and jet pump are installed to the bottom of the tank so if you ever need to take out or replace one of these it would be good to have as little fuel in the tank as possible. You will have to unclip both sides on the fuel or jet pump and then you will be able to remove the fuel pump.....

Always remember to DISCONNECT THE BATTERY BEFORE STARTING THIS PROCESS JUST TO INSURE NOT ARC OR ELECTRICAL SPARK - YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED - This is for your own safety....No nothing happened when I replaced mine, just want to make sure that if anyone else tries to do this that they have the information and the hazards upfront....

I am now going to go outside and play in traffic....I will let you know whether the lincolns goes down the rode or to the CRUSHER....

Thanks for everyone's input and help, let me know if I can ever return the favor.....

[Four Eyed Stangs]

Did you retest fuel pressure after the pump change?

How about a new regulator?

[CK]

Hey don't quit now!!!! I need help!!! :confused: I was checking the internet for problems with the Lincoln LS and found this forum. I am having the exact same problem with my 2000 LS with 42,000 miles on it.

I originally suspected it was a coil pack so I decide to change plugs and check for any oil leaks that may have shorted the coil. No oil leaking on mine.! I guess I am fortunate for that anyway. Well, I changed the plugs and still had the miss which has grown increasingly worse and now requires a feathered throttle to keep her running beyond a slow cruise. Any amount of throttle will bog it horibbly and cause the trans to downshift and rev 4000 to 6000 rpm.

Took it to a friends shop today to check codes for a misfiring cylinder and found that his computer won't show misfiring cylinders on my 2000. However, while he was reving the car hard from idle it died and wouldn't start. His computer showed the mass air flow was pulling 2.7 volts when shut off, where it should be .00 to .002. Strange thing was that it didnt set off a code and once the car sat for a couple of minutes, it started and the voltage went back to normal. However, he again stabbed the car and it died again locking the sensor at 3.2 volts. Cleaned the sensor and tried it again and still the same. He says the MA sensor is bad, just not coding. Approximately $200 for a sensor so I will go and get one and hope I am luckier than others that have spent much more.

As far as all of the other problems with the 2000 LS I must say they are happening. I had such good luck with this car and was so pleased for years, but all of a sudden, once the warranty was up, oh my! :rolleyes:

I will let you know what the outcome of my problem is and hopefully we can figure this out.

[HOTLINC]

I'm not totally sure, but I believe the Mass Air Flow Sensor is a part of the Airbox assembly. I have a 2000 V6 and bought a 2002 airbox off of www.fordpartsnetwork.com (http://www.fordpartsnetwork.com) for $144. I believe the sensor is part of it. You would get the benefits of a freer breathing engine - if nothing else!

It is most likely one of those pesky COP's. They sit right on the spark plug. Buy a good one and replace each one at a time and drive between each attempt to see which is bad. The symptom is exactly the same as on my V6 when they go bad.

[CK]

Well I changed the Mass Air sensor and it is 95% improved. The car still has an occasional miss and I therefore believe it still has a bad coil pack. However, I can floor the car again and it will not bog or hesitate. No more shutting off or having to feather it.

I ended up getting the mass air unit for $150 from the dealer with exchange.

Going to put it on the dealers computer to check for misfiring cylinder and hopefully find the bad coil.

P.S. There was no visible sign of damage or dirt, etc... in the old Mass Air. Even clened it with denatured alcohol and no luck. Guess they just go bad like any other electrical component!

[myndkrime]

Hello Lincoln LS Owners

Well just to let you know how things have worked out.

There are some mechanics, a friend of mine in the business recommended, that used to work for the "stealerships" but went out on their own. I had the car towed to them and they kept it for the week. Friday morning I received a call that my car was ready and that the problem was the jet pump. They replaced the fuel pump and the jet pump. If you have been following this you know that I just replaced the fuel pump. Well they replaced those with dealer replacement parts after a week of dianosing.

I went to pick up the car and pay the $1K bill for parts and labor, that hurt.

Went out to my car and it did not want to start at first, then it cranked up. They said it could have had air still in the fuel lines, yea that's possible...Well I took off down the road like a bat out of hell to see if the car was really fixed and it was running like it used to...Passing people at will and just flooring it to make sure that there was no bog or miss. Ran like a charm all the way home.

After I got home I parked it and got busy doing things around the house. About 3 hours later my wife decides that she wants to go out to get something to eat. We hop in the LS and I crank it up and it just stumbles and stumbles. I shut it off and cranked it again, this time it would not start at all, just kept turning over. I WAS NOT HAPPY!!!
Tried the car again later after we got back home and tried to start the LS again....Same thing, turns over but won't run at all.

So I called the garage back up on Monday morning and let them know that the car was NOT fixed and who their tow contract was with so it could be towed in.
I heard nothing from them all week so I didn' t know what the status of the car was. Friday morning I called them up and talked to the mechanic that had worked on the car. They found that one of the prongs on the fuel pump relay had been bent so that after a certain time it would not make good contact. They tested this during the week to make sure that they could reproduce the problem of the car not running and that it was fixed.....
There was NO CHARGE on the tow or the second trip to the garage.

I have had my car back for over a week now and I have been driving it everywhere I can and have had no problems at all. My LS is finally running like it is supposed to and is starting everytime I try.......

This has been a real fun experience....

Thought that everyone would like to know that it is finally fixed and running....

[Four Eyed Stangs]

Well at least it is fixed!

God I hope it wasn't just the relay the whole time! :eek:

[CK]

Well I am glad to hear that yours is fixed, especially after all the time and effort you spent to get there.

I just hope I am not getting ready to go through the same experience. I earlier posted that my problem was 95% fixed after changing the Mass Air, however after further driving I recant my earlier post.

I have also suspected a bad coil or two based on other peoples similar complaints, so I went looking further. I had already changed the plugs and checked the coils on the passenger side and found no leaking valve cover gasket and assumed the Drivers side was probably in the same shape. Well, I was wrong and after looking at the driver side I found the cover was leaking and all plug wells were soaked in oil. Today I changed the gasket, all plugs and all coils on that bank. Guess what, I still have the problem! The car drives smooth and no misses, but it still bogs down majorly and cuts out when you accelerate quickly. If you accelerate somewhat slow and then floor it you can get it to run up to 80MPH with no problem.

I am starting to believe my problem is a transmission problem. The reason I say that is that when you floor it,or accelerate hard, the car will bog just as if it is hitting on its rev limiter and then the car will come back and rev up to 5000 or 6,000 rpm and stay there even driving at a normal pace. It is also in another gear when that happens.

Has anyone had any similar type of probem with the trans in their LS.

Please help! :confused: :confused:

[HOTLINC]

In your post, you said that you "Checked the coils on the passenger side". I'm not sure how you check them other than replacing them with a new one - one at a time until you find the problem COP.

I would still suspect COP's on that side, too. Even if you try cleaning up the driver side old COP's and installing them on the passenger side - you may find your problem.

[CK]

Hey Hotlinc, thansk for the reply. When I said I checked the coils I meant that I had checked them for oil. Well I have now changed all 8 coils and the car still has the same bog and die under acceleration. It is not always but it is becoming more frequent. It is also becoming more of problem since the car is shutting off and not starting without waiting for several minutes.

I have an appointment with the dealer Tuesday for a trans flush and reflash the comouter for any and all applicable updates. I certainly hope they find something.

[CK]

Sorry, I see the fuel pressure info on an earlier post.

[megaforcer]

quote:Originally posted by myndkrime:
My LS is finally running like it is supposed to and is starting everytime I try.......


Oh man I was really waiting for that gallon of gas and match trick :D

Seriously now, glad it got fixed. Ahhh these Lincolns, it’s always something with them isn’t it? :D

[CK]

Still have the problem!!! I just got the car back from the dealer today after a Trans flush and a reflash of the computer with all applicable updates. When I picked it up tonight, after close, the advance track light is now flashing constantly, but it seemed to run and shift better. Good right? Wrong, that wasonly until it warmed up and I accelerated to half throttle and it bogged down again. Tried it several more times on the way home down side streets and it bogged down and shut off, just as before. Smells really bad when it does. Convertors must be getting flooded.

OK here is what I have changed and the 2000 lS Sport V8 is still pathetic!

All 8 coil packs
2 Valve cover gaskets
Mass Air sensor
Update computer
Trans Flush
All Spark Plugs (Motorcraft)

P.S. Dealer said the computer is not holding any codes! They haven't driven the car yet and dont understand what I am telling them. I will make them drive it tomorrow! Let them stall in traffic and have to sit there and see if they take a little more interest.

The car drives so good at a very light throttle you just can't give it gas, once it is warmed up. That is why I dont believe it to be fuel pump issues as it only occurs once it is heated up.

I will keep you updated incase you are having the same problem. It sure seems like plenty of us are.

[84mark]

any dealership telling you you need a 'complete tuneup' is a complete ripoff.....

[myndkrime]

CK well how goes it? Sounds just like how my car was acting. Just remember when it comes to the fuel system you have the fuel pump on the right rear and the jet pump on the left rear. Fuel is picked up on the right side of the tank, closest to the fill nozzle, and pumped to the jet pump which will assist in pumping the gas forward to the motor.

[GranPappy]

CK- did you ever figure out what the problem was? Im going threw troubles with my ls right now similar to what you seem to be fighting with. Just did the gasket replacement and 4 of the 8 COP but Its still missing under heavy acceleration. Im getting the other 4 COP double checked to make sure its not one of them but thats as far as Ive gotten.

[sl8]

i would check the pressure regulator and if thats good then check injectors . there is normally isnt a fuel pump that just wimpers like ur sayin urs might be they normaly work fine or they just die and they usualy die at the gas station right after u fuel up !

[GranPappy]

Turns out my problem was that the mechanic missed a coils that were bad. Switched it out and now she running perfect.

[joker77]

I'm having a similar problem with my 2000 ls. took it in for trans work, replaced all the inside electronics of the trans, still slipping. is your car missing on the spark or on shifts. my problem seems to be a faulty powertrain control module. spent over $2000, still having problems. ready to burn this car.

[nailfoot]

I'm having a similar problem with my 2000 ls. took it in for trans work, replaced all the inside electronics of the trans, still slipping. is your car missing on the spark or on shifts. my problem seems to be a faulty powertrain control module. spent over $2000, still having problems. ready to burn this car.

After $2000 on a 5 year old or less car, I would want to burn it too! I hope you figure it out, and someone here can help you!

[Rick2]

Did you try replacing the ignition coil? That is what went wrong with a Taurus I have. A relatively cheap fix. Also, what kind of fuel are you using, I did not see anyone mention the type of gas, but I know some cars become very tempermental on 87 octane. If you change the coil, change the plugs again because they still will be flooded.

[Rick2]

I have had my car back for over a week now and I have been driving it everywhere I can and have had no problems at all. My LS is finally running like it is supposed to and is starting everytime I try.......

This has been a real fun experience....

Thought that everyone would like to know that it is finally fixed and running....

Ooops, I missed that. Mod may delete my posts if you wish.