'85 Speaker Wire Identification?

[AceFrehley03]

Well, I got my hands on a head unit and a mounting kit. The head unit is a cheapy, just a Rampage (Audiovox?) and the mounting kit.. well, works. It was free, and its going to have to do until I get some money.

The mounting kit came with some wiring harness adapters but they're for '86 to '92, not '84 and '85. They're NOTHING LIKE the ones in my dash.

What I was going to do is cut off the ones from the back of my original stereo (have two,) and then splice them on. My question is, what wires go to what speaker?

(The nearest Wal-Mart is nearly a hundred miles from where I live, nobody tell me to go there please. Going there to buy an adapter is just about out of the question right now, money's tight. tongue.gif )

What wires in the harness will I have to splice to what now? If the wire colors matched it'd be so much easier..

If this makes any sense, thanks for the help. If it doesnt, go ahead and flame me, and thanks for the flame. :D

[ April 28, 2004: Message edited by: AceFrehley03 ]

[LSC SS]

This should be what you need. It's for an 89 but I believe the colors are the same throughout the years.

http://fordvschevy.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=12594&stc=1

[ April 28, 2004: Message edited by: LSC SS ]

[AceFrehley03]

Hmmm. The colors on mine are different, but those are the same that are listed with the kit...

I have two connectors, one with 4 wires, one with 8, or actually 7 because one wire is looped over to take up two holes.

The 8-wire connector, which I assume is for the speakers, has...

-Black w/ white stripes (which loops over, so it takes up two of the holes with one output wire, making this actually a 7 wire unit. :confused: )

-Pink w/ yellow/lime green/gold striping

-Orange w/ yellow

-Pink w/ silver/white

-Pink w/ light blue

-Green w/ orange

-White w/ light green


The 4 wire connector has...

-Orange w/ silver

-Light Blue w/ red

-Yellow w/ brown

-Green w/ yellow

Thanks again... :confused:

[LSC SS]

Maybe someone with an 84 or 85 EVTM can help out here

[AceFrehley03]

I found a picture of the wire harness I would have to buy... and I wrote down some wire colors and matched them to the corresponding holes. I'll see if I can go from there. Thanks.

[Nick]

Ace, to add in just a head unit, you need to get a PAC OEM II adapter from Crutchfield. The common ground stereo in the car will not support aftermarket equipment. If you wanted to add in speakers, new wires are needed for each speaker location. Check out my post in the thread prior to this one. I explain the system in detail there.

As a side note, it's easier to just get the harness adapters from Walmart or wherever. Crutchfield will have them and that is where I got everything I needed. I installed an Alpine deck in my Continental and I used the adapter and harnesses.

[AceFrehley03]

If the PAC OEM-II adapter is required, I'm curious as to why they have simple plug and play harnesses. They're not fused, they don't have separate grounds, they're just common, plain and simple plug and play connectors.

I'm just skipping one step and adding a few of my own - I'm trying to build my own little plug-n-play harness. I'm just trying to figure out which wires go to which...

It worked on our last Lincoln, which was an '84, but then again that was my dad who did that one. I'm just doing this one on my own. :D

[AceFrehley03]

Alright, well, I got the wires done so that I have power. I got the stereo on, works great. Rear speakers are there, and balance properly.

The fade function does not work. The front speakers do not work.

I mentioned a 7 wire adapter, in which the negative wire for the front speakers were shared. Pins 3 and 6 were looped together, and a wire came out. The stereo had separate grounds for the front speakers. I connected both of those grounds to the shared front ground, I'm guessing this is my problem. What should I do to fix this? Do I need to remove that loop from the harness, and make individual wires?

[ April 28, 2004: Message edited by: AceFrehley03 ]

[Nick]

I'm sorry I missed your original post about Walmart and extra harnesses, Ace.

You've lost me on your wiring. I don't think I can be of much help. I only knew how to make it all work from the adapters.

[AceFrehley03]

Don't worry about it Nick. I was pretty tired when I wrote all that so it probably made as much sense as Latin or something like that.

Schucks has the wiring harness adapter as well, and its 8 miles away. $11.99. Wal-Mart is cheaper, but after fuel, Schucks would be cheaper.

If I were to buy that adapter, and do it that way, would I have my front speakers, or would they still be unoperational?

So far I'm looking at one of two options. A total rewire, converting from coaxial to about 12 gauge wire, or buying the adapter and going from there. We're looking at roughly the same price. Which is most worth it?

Also, is this a potential tech article? Lol. Save someone else the pain? :rolleyes:

[ April 28, 2004: Message edited by: AceFrehley03 ]

[Nick]

I'm not sure what harness or adapter you mean, but here are the two options as I see it. Perhaps SQ can correct me if I am wrong.

You can either rewire a common ground system and install new speakers, or use an adapter to mate an aftermarket head unti with a common ground system.

You can't or shouldn't power the stock speakers directly as they are 6 ohm while the new deck is 4 ohm. Doing so may damage the deck as the volume probably needs to be cranked up much higher to produce normal listening level volume on the speakers.

The rewire is a lot of work, but would be worthwhile if you intend to install aftermarket speakers. You can find a set of newer factory speakers to replace the ones you have now to get cheap 4 ohm components. 1988+ Marks used the 4 ohm system, but speakers from another car could work too. The PAC OEM II is about $30 with shipping from Crutchfield. It's not exactly cheap, but it worked for me in the Continental. I have all the functions like fade too. The benefit of buying through Crutchfield is their tech support and their vehicle specific wiring info and install instructions. It may be slightly cheaper overall to rewire everything and install 4 ohm speakers.

Here is a broad picture of how my car was wired with the PAC. If I remember right, There were 2 harnesses I needed for the Continental. One had the power lead, amplifier lead, and maybe a couple other wires while the other one had 4 wires for the speakers. These pluged into their corresponding factory counterparts. The ends of the aftermarket harness adapters were spliced with the PAC OEM II and the receiver's wiring harness.

[AceFrehley03]

Yours sounds close to mine. I have two harnesses, one eight pin, one four pin.

The four pin is a small square that powers the antenna/amplifier line, constant 12v, switched 12v, and ground.

The eight pin is the negative and positive wire for each speaker. 2 x 4 = 8 wires. The front speakers share a ground, so they hoop together in the harness.

[Nick]

Ahhh my memory fails me. I have the things mixed up. I probably do have that 8 pin harness and I know I have that 4 pin.

[AceFrehley03]

Well, I'm going to attempt to write a tech article out of this, lol. It IS possible to do without the adapter. It HAS to be.

It just eludes me at this moment. :D

[Nick]

It's a lot more wiring than I'd ever want to do to the car. Of course, that's why I'm trying my hand at mechanical engineering and not electrical. :D I'll leave the innovative stuff for the EE.

[pepsi2185]

Ace you have a front common system. Easy fix. You have to go into the kick and find the wires going into the door boot. Disconnect the one that goes common and run it up to the deck. Me personally i do not like adapters and its cheaper to just run the wire. The 6 ohm speaker will work fine on a deck. The speaker is coax at the door. Somwhere between the speaker and behind the dash that wire becomes common with the other doors negative wire and possibly goes to chassis. The best way to eliminate it is to either find that wire in the kick or trace it from the speaker itself and match colors from the deck plug.

You do want to replace that rampage unit when you get the money. Unbelieveable change in sound quality from that to a name brand. Most of the guys on here like alpine. The difference between these two is night and day bro.

Good luck on the wiring if you havent already picked up that adapter.

By the way did you have an internal amp. Did you have to power up the amplifier lead to get the speakers to work. It also may be in your best intrest to eliminate that amp. But if you happy with it why mess with it.

Big Joe

[AceFrehley03]

Hey Joe, yeah, I caved in and bought the adapter at Schucks, $12. Naturally it didn't work, I had the same problems as I did BEFORE the Adapter, and then some. I'm going to take it back and aim for some 12 gauge wire.

First of all, the front speakers are dead. This is a given. Secondly, when you turn it up past roughly half way it begins to fade out, crackle extensively, and dim the lights. Third, turning on lights shuts the power off to the radio completely. I think this has to do with the dimmer, which I'll just disconnect completely. The crackling I heard, what was that? If I had a way I would let you guys listen to it. It goes up to a certain volume, then its like the car loses the power to keep it going. The speakers start to static and quiet out, the lights flicker and dim, gauges dim.

I opened up the kick panel on the passenger side and almost messed my pants when I saw how many similiar-colored wires I had to deal with. So I should cut the wire right there in the kick panel and just run it straight to the deck, so in other words the amp will power the 6X9's and that's all?

[RJ Sclafani]

Ace, you don't need 12ga wire, just buy 16ga. Even on subwoofers, 8ga or 16ga, makes no difference. If you would like to discuss the matter with someone, I have a friend who works at Adire Audio, and he will tell you the same thing. As for the harnesses, screw them and just wire the speakers to the HU. An hour out of the day well worth it. just my $0.02

[AceFrehley03]

16 gauge it is, then. I'm just confused when it comes to running this wires. How do I know I have the right ones once I'm down in the kick panel, fussing with 50-100 wires, some of which are duplicate colors?

[RJ Sclafani]

Are you still talking about the stock wires? If not, it should be easy to find your own wire if you are running the wires to the doors directly from the HU. You said you had an amp? What will it be powering?

[AceFrehley03]

Yes, we're talking about the stock wires. I'm also talking about the factory amp, the one between the 6x9's on the package shelf. I'm going to run the wires from the door directly to the head unit. I just have to find which wires to cut, and where.

[RJ Sclafani]

If you are running new wires to the HU from the door speakers, why do you need to cut into the stock wires? Are you talking about trying to cut the wires for the rear speakers? You have me kinda confused as to what you are trying to do. Sorry.

[AceFrehley03]

Well, its the common ground system in the front speakers, right? My head unit calls for individual ground speakers. I just want to separate the common ground from the speakers so they'll work, rather then having all of the sound behind me. The speakers won't work if I splice everything together.

I want to re-wire the front speakers so I have a + and a - for each speaker, rather then a + for each speaker and a combined, common - for both. As far as tapping into the original speaker wire, well, it has to go common somewhere, right? I just want to tap into it before there.

I also bought wire. It's only 18 gauge, but it was the biggest they had. They were picked over.. must be stereo time. :rolleyes:

[AceFrehley03]

Alright. I rewired the front speakers and I got them to work. They sound clear but they're pretty quiet.

I'm having trouble working out my little power problem, though. The radio has four power leads. 12V Constant, 12V Switched, Ground, and the Amplifier/Antenna Lead. I can get the wires hooked up so that the radio will turn on, but it does some odd things.

First, you turn the park lights or headlights on, and the radio shuts off.

The louder you turn up the stereo, the more the lights on the overhead console dim (compass and thermometer.)

It also does this odd resetting thing. You turn it up loud enough, the speakers seem like they run out of juice, then the stereo resets to the beginning of the track again. It's bizarre.

What were the four wires on the small square harness for on the original stereo?


(UPDATE: I noticed something. When you have the lights on the car, the radio does not get power. This is with the panel dim at minimum, I.E. the lights are the brightest. When you roll that dial down and dim the lights, the radio lights up for a second, and tries to power up. It fades to black temporarily. I've used the dimmer wire as my primary, haven't I?)

[ April 29, 2004: Message edited by: AceFrehley03 ]

[AceFrehley03]

T.T.T. smile.gif

[Nick]

Those are the strangest things I have heard in a long time for a stereo install. Ace, I looked up the wire colors inmy EVTM for '85 Marks and Continentals. I don't know why I didn't remember I had this with me at school.

LH Door: O/LG H Dashed & LB/W H Dashed
RH Door: W/LG H Dashed & DG/O Striped
LH Rear: PK/LG Striped & PK/LB D Dotted
RH Rear: DG/O D Dotted & PK/LB Striped

I'm not sure what the H and D represent.

I don't see splicing of the speaker wires like I do on the Continental. The Mark's wires look like they run straight to the amplifier and the radio.

From the wiring diagrams, it looks like the rear speakers were powered by the radio and the amplifier powered the fronts. It looks like the power wire should be O/LB D Dotted. There are 4 wires that go to the instrument cluster and the courtesy lamps. Two are LB/R for the instruments and the other two are LG/Y for the Courtesy Lamps. The other three wires that come out of the radio go to the amp. They are W/R Striped, LG, and BK/W H Dashed. The rear speakers are wired straight to the radio. That should be all the wires that come out of the radio. There is a Y/BK H Dashed wire that goes to the mobile phone, but that may not exist unless Ford prewired all the cars for the option.

I hope that helps!

[AceFrehley03]

Got it. Thanks Nick.

And will someone maybe try to Archive this one? I'm thinking about making a tech article out of this.

[pepsi2185]

This is probably too late, but i dont have anything to do anyway.

Did you yank out the amp yet??? You can catch all four speakers there. It looks like a football. Its like oval shaped under the rear deck. You are probably going to have to rewire the rears too.

You said you get:

hissing at high volume = amp clipping
radio turning on and off with headlight = dimmer wire for power to radio. Remember there are negative illumination dimmers back there too. Run your negative right to chassis. Get a test light or meter and test your wires. You probably have a bad ground and are running constant to the dimmer or something. I would not use the radio until you fix the wiring. Any of the other guys here can attest to fords cheap instrument panel dimmers. Running more power through there may cause you problems.

keep us posted on your rewire situation

[AceFrehley03]

Well, I made my own ground. I drilled it to a metal support of the dash, used a self tapping screw, and ran some 20 Gauge wire. It works.

What I had done was I used a dimmer wire as my primary. Since my radio doesnt use a dimmed, I cut it and blocked it off.

That left me with three wires. One was random B.S. that I still dont know about, my constant 12V, and my switched 12V. I just hooked up the constants to the constants and the switched to the switched. I used butt connectors for all this.

For the doors, I actually didn't have Nick's information handy. It was accurate, so I wish I would've. I popped off my speaker covers and peeked in my door to look at the wires. I wrote down what two I had. I then yarded off my kick plate and looked through that big god almighty mess of a harness down there, and pulled out my two keepers. I cut them right in the middle so I had room to work on both sides. Put the ones going back in a safe place, and I spliced on my 18 g. wire, wrote down what wire went to what, and then ran it up through my dash.

On the passenger side I dropped my glovebox and taped it up nice and good. On the driver side I took off the plastic cover underneath the dash and went up through that.

I hooked those straight into the H.U. and left them out of the harness all together. Hooked up my antenna and that was all she wrote. Pics will come soon.

[SQ_LSC]

Ace, did you ever try just cutting the loop from the plug? I haven't worked with the older system on the Lincolns yet and I'm curious about that one. The way it stands now, you ran new wiring for the front speakers and cut and spliced in the kicks. It's great you got it working but I don't think it's advise that can be used by alot of people who have less experience.

[AceFrehley03]

I didn't even try.

Reasoning being, the system isn't converted to common ground right there at the connector. I figured it was converted back somewhere around the amplifier.

I just found it much easier to run all new wire. It wasn't nearly as hard as one would think. If the weather is cooperative today, I'll go out and snap some pictures, and put on some more detailed information. If you still don't like it then I won't bother writing up an article. If you do, then I'll get right on it.

I swear to god it wasn't that hard, lol. All patience. A drunk, slightly retarded monkey could do it as long as he wasn't color blind.

[ April 30, 2004: Message edited by: AceFrehley03 ]

[RJ Sclafani]

Yeah, running wires is a pretty novice thing. I'm a network tech/admin, and when they taught me to network, I learned how to be a wire monkey first and foremost. I think people shouldn't be so afraid of touching electronics. I mean, if you can read through about 5 min of basic electric stuff, you pretty much have it all down in theory. Then you need to apply it to real life and try it yourself. I'm all for a tech article, but I think it should be a little more informative, maybe Ace and I could come up with something together, as I have done the same thing to many cars.

[AceFrehley03]

Sounds good to me, but I'm going to go ahead and put in a disclaimer here.

Yes, electronics are fairly easy when it comes to wires. No, you can't blame him (or me, even) if you get fried because you didn't know what you were doing and/or you tempted fate and/or you tried to turn a wiring job into a pull my finger joke.

There is enough electricity in a car to kill a person, always keep that in mind. Same principal as a house - a 110V hot wire is more likely to kill you then a 440+ wire.

[RJ Sclafani]

haha.. true, practically anything can can kill you though. Even a rat plagued with the black death.

[AceFrehley03]

Those killed millions of people so that doesn't count. Why don't we say something a little more odd, like, oh, I don't know, a tupperware container? A type R sticker?

[RJ Sclafani]

ahahhhaha... a type R sticker. good one dawg. ;)

[AceFrehley03]

I'm serious... you know, someone out there HAS to have died from a Type-R sticker. Or something Type-R related.

[SQ_LSC]

no, pulling wires is not difficult but it's what we usually recommend and when people hear that, they think or say there's gotta be an easier way and get discouraged. I was hoping you'd pinpoint a deffinitive spot upfront where you could split the speakers by only popping one kick, or something to that effect. Might not sound as freightening to some people.

Did you remove the rear amp from the vehicle and use a bypass harness for the rears?

[AceFrehley03]

No, I did not remove the rear amp yet. It's still there. Because I don't know which way the current flows in the wires, I've just safeguarded the wires until I get something more permanent.